Weekly poll results: the Asus Zenfone 8 excites, Zenfone 8 Flip flops

23 May 2021
The €600 flagship that can be used comfortably one-handed could be just what people were waiting for.

Sort by:

  • D
  • AnonD-909757
  • pZV
  • 25 May 2021

Anonymous, 24 May 2021Can you keep your replies short? Most people will rather sk... moreNope, I am tired of people always trying to find any single missing information to try to prove they are right even against hard proofs, I hate not giving enough information, and if no one were to answer me I would in fact prefer it, most of my comments aren't for other users anyway.

    • D
    • AnonD-909757
    • pZV
    • 25 May 2021

    salarx, 24 May 2021Moving parts are niche. It's proved by the fact that n... moreDude, literally when all phones all the same and lack diversity, how do you want something else to thrive?
    Based on that logic, Telephoto, 3.5mm Jack and Bezels are niche...
    Of course not, there are tons of things that are highly requested that the phone industry doesn't do, just getting rid of the 2Mp camera, or upgrading them to 5Mp, 8Mp or even 12Mp, as 12Mp sensors that provide good quality cost next to nothing.
    The smartphone industry DOES NOT produce things based on demand unlike every other industry, they just lazily copy each others and settled on a single design.
    Ok, then lets talk about a car electric windows, it has to face wind/air pressure from speed, vibrations, shocks/bumps, humidity, wide range of temperatures, is often operated, yet it is clearly not something that often break, compare it with a non-moving things, like a light bulb, it is sitting on your ceiling, no vibrations, controlled temperature and humidity, yet they break much more often.
    The same goes for pop up camera, yes, some break, I never said that none do, but it is a RARE OCCURRENCE.
    Protection against water and dust? The Poco F2 Pro is IP53 rated, why isn't it enough?
    IP67 & IP68 rated phones DO die from liquids, IP rating isn't a magical protection, it is only a certification, and I am sure that if you were to compare any similarly sold (in number) phones, one with IP68, the other with pop up, you'll find more of the IP68 one dying from water, because people think the IP rated phone is a submarine, while those who have the pop up are careful, IP rating or not, NO PHONES should be put in water at all, and NOT A SINGLE of the major brand cover water damages.
    And this is not even talking about the fact that the pop up can actually be made water-resistant.

    Removing one camera from the flip up would mean fewer quantity of materials to be used, lighter design, easier for the motor, overall cheaper.
    Punch holes are expensive, it isn't as simple as drilling a hole, you have to reroute all the wiring, which isn't as simple as you might think, on the other hand, pop up cost is easy to find, you just have to check on spare parts websites, and the whole assembly, motor, enclosure and all, including the camera, don't cost more than 15$.
    In fact, some of the cheapest smartphones have pop up camera, look at the Huawei P Smart Z, the Honor 9x and 9x Pro and the Infinix S5 Pro for example, they are super cheap and still have a pop up, definitely proving the pop up isn't expensive.
    The 3 most popular phones with pop up (OnePlus 7(T) Pro, K20 (Pro)/Mi 9T Pro, and K30 Pro/Pro Zoom/Ultra/Poco F2 Pro) are popular BECAUSE they did sell well and people were satisfied with the pop up camera.
    And this is despite only few different phone models with this having been made.
    Why does people say the iPhone Mini didn't sell well? It was NEVER expected to sell as much as the others, and it has A LOT of things that make it not that attractive, stop thinking that :
    A phone with X feature doesn't sell, so X feature isn't desired.
    There are much more to take into consideration than a single feature when choosing a phone, and the other iPhones models are still quite smaller than most Android smartphones anyway, it isn't as if it was all black and white.
    Apple never said themselves the Mini didn't sell well, only the news media did, and it still sold MILLIONS.
    Sony is a totally different story, and it DOES have its fans, but many still have holder phones, they are expensive, and again, it doesn't require 100 bazillions of sells to be stable.

    It CLEARLY IS diversity, having phones DIFFERENT from one another IS diversifying things, a phone with MORE OR LESS feature is the same thing, it does things differently.
    If what you said was true, why would 1000$+ Samsung Galaxy S21 Ultra, Apple iPhone 12 Pro Max and Xiaomi Mi 11 Ultra sell so well then?

    I never say they should use a 100 Tera-Tesla magnet, just enough to prevent it from flapping which is a known issue, and it uses a stepper motor which is the best kind of electric motor for torque at low speed (and since low speed is under 2000 RPM, it is more than enough for the Flip Up).
    There are many solutions, not only, with all the Stove camera island nowadays, symmetry isn't a concern anymore, but if it was, they could add a ToF, a Macro or anything else on the other side.
    Or combine Wide and Ultra-Wide using either a continuous variable Zoom or two focal length mode camera.
    The flash isn't symmetrical anyway, while they could have done something like Meizu who have a flash ring around the center camera to keep it symmetrical on the Meizu 17/17 Pro.

      • J
      • Jim
      • pJ%
      • 24 May 2021

      salarx, 24 May 2021Moving parts are niche. It's proved by the fact that n... moreWhere are the widespread reports if the zenfone flip cameras failing? Oh wait, they don't exist.

        • ?
        • Anonymous
        • 7kd
        • 24 May 2021

        AnonD-909757, 24 May 2021Moving parts ARE NOT a niche, and people are much less afra... moreCan you keep your replies short? Most people will rather skip reading long paragraphs.

          • ?
          • Anonymous
          • kwx
          • 24 May 2021

          AnonD-909757, 24 May 2021"sales were low" How much were sold?enough for apple to stop thinking about a refresh... they won't stop successful products now, would they?

            AnonD-909757, 24 May 2021Moving parts ARE NOT a niche, and people are much less afra... moreMoving parts are niche. It's proved by the fact that none of the phones released in 2021 have a pop-up camera. Most people will carry this DSRL in a pouch and carry it with extra care, and try not to drop it, since the lens will break on impact. Nobody uses their DSRL as much as they use their phones, and phones go through more abuse than a DSLR. Hence a phone requires protection against dust and water. And moving parts costs more based on their accuracy and life. And take size in consideration too, smaller the hinge / gears, weaker they are. Steel foils are weaker than steel doors right? That's why Zenfone's flipcam uses liquid metal (amorphous metal alloy) instead of steel, which is expensive to produce. Don't know about pop-up mechanisms, but my friend had Oneplus 7 Pro, and its popup camera failed and had to be repaired. The mass produced Samsung punchole OLEDs can't possibly be more expensive than these fullscreen displays. I have a Redmi K20, and the popup cam still works fine, so what you said might be true, but brands moving on to puncholes proves it's cheaper than those moving parts, otherwise why would they throw away those extra profits, since you claim phones with pop-up camera were popular? And being popular doesn't mean it's a device people will actually buy. iPhone Mini and most Sony Phones are best example.

            By increasing cost, I simply meant adding features / hardware increases the cost, and make the device less competitive. Poco is an example of a phone which strips down on those thing that a normal user doesn't care about to keep the cost low, it's not diversity but simple cost cutting, and a phone supported by ads. It's not anything unique, but the price it's available at makes everything else insignificant.

            And phone loyalty exists for some vague reasons. Apple does nothing innovative in their phones (if removing features is considered innovative that's different issue). Sony fans are just talk, if they really exist, Sony would be in top 5 manufacturers. Huawei and Samsung are the real deal, and they have built the base over the years. They are not super diverse, it's just other brands have worse diversity and marketing.

            And removing a camera from flipcam won't decrease the cost due to flipcam. Zenfone 6 had two cameras, and it still used liquid metal for a thin and light flip module. And I'm not sure about magnets, could work, or couldn't, how much strain would it put on motors to overcome the force, if magnets will get weak over time, etc. If they want to put telephoto on main body and other two camera's on flipcam, they'd have to go with vertical implementation. Otherwise the layout would be misaligned, or two cameras on top and one on bottom, which would again waste the space for other things (like battery). Though it's be cool to see Zenfone with vertical Cameras, which Flip to front from sides.

              • A
              • Abhi
              • rKn
              • 24 May 2021

              no ois in zenfone 8 flip is deal breaker

                • D
                • AnonD-909757
                • pZV
                • 24 May 2021

                man, 24 May 2021The thing about such poles is that votes are generally cast... more"sales were low"
                How much were sold?

                  • D
                  • AnonD-909757
                  • pZV
                  • 24 May 2021

                  salarx, 24 May 2021A fullscreen bezel-less phone is not a niche, but a phone w... moreMoving parts ARE NOT a niche, and people are much less afraid of them than it is commonly said.
                  Tons of things use moving parts and has no issues about it, a comparable thing is the pop up flash and all the motorized lenses on DSLR, those existed for decade and people didn't complain about moving parts, nor they often break.
                  Moving parts on pop ups more than proved they are reliable enough to exceed the phone operational lifetime.
                  And no, it doesn't add to the cost, I'd even argue it cost less than a punch hole.

                  People say that pop up are niche, people are afraid, they don't want it, etc, yet, the OnePlus 7(t) Pro, Mi 9T (Pro), K20 (Pro), Poco F2 Pro and K30 (Pro/Pro Zoom/Ultra) sold extremely well while having a pop up, and the vast majority of owners of those phones are really satisfied with it.
                  Yeah they are a good value, but so does many other phones, and in fact, it proves that the pop up isn't a costly, the Poco F2 Pro has many features that much more expensive phones don't and still is one of the cheapest SD865 phone.
                  In fact, on a website like Kimovil (who unlike GSMArena don't have phone popularity affected by what the latest news/article was) popularity poll continuously see the Poco F2 Pro on its list, currently it is 11th, and the old Mi 9T Pro is 21th, proving people do like the pop up.
                  And even more would have if it wasn't for all the lies about it, try to find a single article talking about pop up camera that doesn't have a comment talking about "waterproofing", "fragility", "moving parts", "durability", "dust" and all that, yet it is still a challenge to find any relevant number of reports about hardware related issues on the pop up.
                  And this is not even regarding all the room to improve it has.
                  Also, note that I wasn't even saying all phones should have pop up or something like that, nor that it is the only thing missing, there are TONS of other things that are left aside, including the simple bezel that still proves today to sell well.


                  Yes the margin is different, but even other markets with similar margin still offer more diversity.
                  Of course, they have nothing to differentiate from each others if they simply keep all doing the same design over and over again.
                  Just making something different would be enough to stand out, but there isn't any big brand beside Samsung and Apple and make modern phones in mid/high range with a simple bezel.
                  And what you mean increasing the cost? I also talked about making striped down phones like the PocoPhone who has a high-end SoC but few features, so it is cheap for those who only seek power and don't care about photography and all that, this is clearly part of diversity, many want this, yet it is nowhere to be found.

                  Competitive, yes, I never said otherwise, but the smartphone market still has virtually 0 diversity.
                  It is crazy that we have almost no options when trying to get a premium phone with a notch or a hole in its display...
                  LG is the perfect example of a brand who didn't know what they wanted to do, they were just randomly trying stuffs, poorly marketed it, abandoned it and had no brand image, and like you said, people couldn't get loyal to them, but Sony, Samsung, Apple or even Huawei did prove that phone loyalty still exist.
                  And most of their features were not the thing making the phone expensive, non Chinese brands are expensive, that's sad but the truth.
                  What make a brand successful depend on MANY things, including where is the phone available, many non-techies will buy their phone on a big store, brand's store or with their carrier, if the phone isn't available in those places, or in countries where people like it, no wonder it isn't successful.
                  Fairphone do many unique things, because of their swapable components, I'd argue they have more R&D cost per phone than brands like Oppo or RealMe, and their niche isn't really that extraordinary, some will buy it because they found it, and it looks good.
                  Many bought gaming phones because it was one of the only way to get a bezel or a phone that doesn't cost too much because of its camera + a Jack + good battery.
                  I'd even argue some bought it because they wanted thicker phones, and other for the look.

                  Anyway, I am not saying that manufacturers need diversity, I am saying that CUSTOMERS need diversity, AND manufacturers can still make profits by doing it.

                  The Zenfone flip camera is kind of stupid in the way that it has the Telephoto on it, why would you put a Telephoto here rather than on the body? The Ultra-Wide, yeah, but the Telephoto?
                  No wonder they had to use special hard to find materials, which is still weird, as there are many alternatives that are common, they didn't even put a small magnet to keep it from flapping when retracted...
                  I think they simply tried to bump up the Zenfone 7 production, but thought about it having lost quite a lot of value and decided to change few components, so they can sell something they already had for the full price of a new phone.

                    • m
                    • man
                    • uwf
                    • 24 May 2021

                    The thing about such poles is that votes are generally casted by enthusiasts, not normal people. that's why iphone 12 mini won the poles but actual sales were low.

                      AnonD-909757, 23 May 2021We have this illusion that niche doesn't work because ... moreA fullscreen bezel-less phone is not a niche, but a phone with moving parts is. Still many will be willing to buy such a phone, as long as it doesn't cost a lot.

                      And cars are different, they have insane amount of margins, for instance, Lamborghini sold 8,205 cars in 2019. Xiaomi sells million in the first minute of the flash sale. Car logic doesn't apply to smartphones. If your margins are extremely high, you won't be competitive unless you have very good brand image. On the other hand, if your margins are low, you have to sell a lot of device. Cars have customer loyalty, and each brand is unique from the other in terms of what they offer. What do smartphones have to distinguish themselves from each other? All run on Android, same apps are available to all users. Only difference is OS Skin. Processor is same brand, all have the same Sony IMX or Samsung Isocell sensor. When majority of smartphones are exactly the same, it's hard for consumer to be loyal. That's why they have to slap 5 cameras, or curved screens to stand out. People want notchless / hole-less experience, but they don't want to pay a premium for it, or are scared of moving parts. Being a niche phone maker is not problem, but when majority of users don't care about a feature, and that feature increases the cost of your phone, people will look for alternatives. It's easier to compare phones as compared to cars.

                      The smartphone market is hell lot of competitive since Chinese brands entered the market. If you sell a product in high volumes, you can keep your margins low and make the phone attractive. If you're going to add crazy features that increase the cost of the phone, make sure your target audience wants that feature at that price, else you'll incur losses. LG is example of such brands who kept adding features nobody asked for, which only made their phone expensive and hence unattractive to majority. They could sell those features, but they didn't market well enough, and dropped those features too soon. And being cheap doesn't mean you are good value, you have to be better than the competition. If your cheap phone has inferior hardware, it's cheap but not in terms of value. And Fairphone is competing in a unique position, they don't need to spent on R&D, and they don't have to compete in terms of features too. They have unique niche, which pays wells, and operating cost is low. It'll work out for them as long as they can make profit out of it. Same works for gaming phones. They are niche, but the niche is large enough to give profits. The brands selling them have years of legacy in gaming laptops (ROG). That's why Xiaomi, who's doing so well in mainstream smartphone category, discontinued BlackShark in India, since they don't have the name like ROG. For the same reason you won't find Legion Phone in India, because ROG is extremely competitively priced here.

                      That brings me to Zenfone series. They were niche devices, but the first Zenfone 6 was extremely competitive in pricing. Everyone will welcome extra features if they don't have to pay extra for it. And it was a shift in Asus too, stock-like ZenUI, headphone jack, triple slot, 5000mah battery, and the phone costed more or less the same as OnePlus 7. The reason it didn't sell so well, was because it was out of stock most of the time, since Asus was having a hard time manufacturing flipcam modules. They released an improved Zenfone 7, but it suffered from same problem. That being said, Zenfone 8 Flip is a strange phone. It costs more than last year, but comes with upgraded processor and indisplay fingerprint sensor. But not sure if that upgrade is worth the price bump.

                        • ?
                        • Anonymous
                        • BXH
                        • 24 May 2021

                        IpsDisplay, 24 May 2021Not gonna lie the title of this article had by belly bustli... more😅 found it quite funny too

                          Zenfone 8 Flip - please and thank you

                            • V
                            • VXH
                            • Xp7
                            • 24 May 2021

                            I would buy a ZF8 Flip WITH a 3.5mm. The regular ZF8 camera lacks the flip quality camera albeit comes with a 3.5mm.

                              Not gonna lie the title of this article had by belly bustling with laughter 🤣

                              You know the writer was just itching to some how get the flip flip phrase in there

                              "Zenfone 8 Flip flops"

                                • ?
                                • Anonymous
                                • Sp0
                                • 24 May 2021

                                Anonymous, 23 May 2021Honestly this phone sounds very good but i still stick to 5... moreCheck the dimension of the device you are comparing it with, says more than screen size as newer screens are taller.

                                  Anonymous, 23 May 2021I mean its so easy to beat this phone....all samsung gotta ... moreisn't it called Pixel 5?

                                    • D
                                    • AnonD-909757
                                    • pZV
                                    • 23 May 2021

                                    salarx, 23 May 2021Catering to niche is really hard when it's not profita... moreWe have this illusion that niche doesn't work because on smartphones, it is either a 100% exactly like the other, or extreme niche like LG Wing or even Red Hydrogen.

                                    Having other feature set, other camera layout, front camera design and all that isn't at all this level of niche, many are still desiring to buy phones with bezels, yet they are pushed out of the market, same with pop up, flagship specs with single camera, low/mid-end with amazing cameras, etc.
                                    And they can definitely make more than decent profits by doing something else than:
                                    50% punch hole/50% teardrop notch + 50% curved edge on high end + no 3.5mm Jack + camera setup equal to SoC power lacking cheap camera phones or striped down power house like the PocoPhone F1, approximately the same size with rare thicker or smaller phones, same tech for X, Y, Z features despite better alternatives existing, etc etc...
                                    No need to aim at niches to make diversity.

                                    Look at cars, micro/small/hatchback, sedan, SUV and minivan are totally different from one another, and yet they aren't niches at all.
                                    Roadsters and sport/super/hyper are, yet they are still selling super well despite being literally out of reach of the vast majority, we aren't talking about being targeted at a certain audience but still everyone can afford it such as some niches smartphones would be, but really totally out of budget for most and still has to please, some brands even exist only out of that.
                                    I often use cars as an example because, like smartphones could, there already is a big diversity in this market and this is something anyone could understand, but really it applies to almost anything.
                                    Smartphones are the exception, and not in the good sense.
                                    And when you know that some luxury phones brands (other than Caviar) exist, make profits and only touch the luxury market, you quickly realize how poor of an excuse it will make if they said that making phones with X or Y thing that "only" 50 millions people ask for isn't profitable...

                                    LG and Sony are totally different from that, not only LG made quite mainstream phones for a while, but Sony phones aren't that niche to begin with, ask any everyday people that aren't tech enthusiasts if they would take X, Y or Z brand phone, most will probably say that as long as it doesn't cost too much they don't care, the Sony design won't really matter.
                                    Otherwise, some of the phones LG made like the cheap K22 or quite "normal" looking Q61 would have sold so well it would have been obvious, same for the bezel-less Xperia L4.
                                    We kept saying that LG was niche, but for me, most of their phones are exactly like any other that over-flood the market.
                                    The ultimate proof is that companies like Fairphone are still there despite actual niche, old design, not so cheap phones, the Fairphone 3+ is even out of stocks, same for Shift and quite a few other niche brands, not even mentioning Purism (Librem phones) and Pinephone.

                                      • ?
                                      • Anonymous
                                      • rKp
                                      • 23 May 2021

                                      I mean its so easy to beat this phone....all samsung gotta do is to release a sequel to s10e with improved battery...thats it! thats how boring this phone is. S10e looked hot tbt. Coolest looking compact phone in recent years

                                        • ?
                                        • Anonymous
                                        • rKp
                                        • 23 May 2021

                                        Honestly this phone sounds very good but i still stick to 5.5 inch mark... thats the max screen size for anything compact...if i cant reach notification bar without any software gimmicks then its not a one hand friendly phone, no matter how compact it might be as per contemporary dimension standards.

                                        I have a feeling that an xperia compact is coming.... this year definitely.