MediaTek Helio P90 is official with Google Lens and ARCore support
- Kiyasuriin
- nYT
- 15 Dec 2018
Kangal, 15 Dec 2018Your method was flawed, but your conclusion is correct.
Th... moreI think the same. But pushing A55 to 2 GHz is a bit too much. I think 1.9 GHz would be fine.
Plus. I've worked with mediatek. ONE THING I've learnt that Mediatek NEVER goes beyond 4 GPU cores.
- ?
- Anonymous
- 08B
- 15 Dec 2018
Kangal, 15 Dec 2018Your method was flawed, but your conclusion is correct.
Th... moreKirin 710 isn't Snapdragon 710 competitor...it's only naming...
In fact, it's SD636/660 competitor.
If uses 4A73+4A53 like SD636/660 (kryo 2x0 serie is A73/A53)
Snapdragon 710 uses cortex A75/A55...
As Mali G51 has 2/3 of G71 engines, G51mp4 is weaker than G72mp3 on Helio P60...
Kirin 710 GPU is SD636/Adreno 509 level...P60 is somewhere between 509 and 512
Nevertheless, I'm not impressed by A75...
They increase instructions per cycle...
It's like putting 1.5 cores in the same core...if improves parallele workload in the core itself, but not dynamic and randomised tasks.
Real-life fealing isn't as amazing as benchmarks said.
In my opinion A73 is still a good deal.
Compare to A72, on A73, they reduce instructions per cycle but get better performances at the same time!
A75/76 increase instructions per cycle and... benchmarks.
And add ARM v8.1
True about your technical analysis about GPU, but you forget...the Price.
You can't put a G76mp8 in a mid range soc...it's nearly flagship range (as ARM doubles the size of their GPU cores (G76mp8 must be near G72mp20)
Frequencies around 900Mhz should be ok in 12nm.
After the bad reputation of X20 (partly wrong : very very very little perfs drop on CPU, about -30% on GPU - compare to -55% on Exynos 7885's GPU), Mediatek cares of thermal problems.
(No framedrop on P60 after 30 minutes on Manhattan 3.1!)
I'm confident...
PS
Here are the 55% drop of Exynos 7885 (compare Manhattan 3.1 on-screen and Manhattan 3.1 long-term performances)
- Kangal
- RN8
- 15 Dec 2018
Kiyasuriin, 13 Dec 2018I just said my method. it's not neccesarily correct. ^_^;Your method was flawed, but your conclusion is correct.
The max frequency is not what the GPU actually runs at, and doing so is usually detrimental to the efficiency of the work.
When it comes to SoC's, its better to have few fast CPU's instead of many cores (more dynamic/randomised instructions), and its better to have many cores in GPU instead of a few fast ones (parallel workload/instruction).
So reading more in-depth of this processor, and its not a great one.
It's basically a later-released Kirin 710, which itself is a worse Snapdragon 710 rival. Here's what they should have done instead:
16nm/10nm (“12FFC”)
Shared L3 cache of 1MB (large enough, cost savings, helps transition threads among cores)
2.4GHz of 2x Cortex A76 (512kb L2)
2.0GHz of 6x Cortex A55 (128kb L2)
0.7GHz Mali-G76-MP8 (or a higher end PowerVR)
Fake NPU but real Marketing ; )
Maybe for the first time, drivers, documentation, source, bootloader unlock etc etc
And even throwing it into AndroidONE phones (Xiaomi Mi A3 ?)
….then ship it into devices selling for US$200, and you have a 2019 winner
- M
- Manhurt
- U}}
- 14 Dec 2018
If Mediatek P90 use Furian based PowerVR GPU. Rogue based GPU its too out dated...
- ?
- Anonymous
- 08B
- 14 Dec 2018
TenMoon, 14 Dec 2018Sounds interesting. With pure A75 cores at their disposal a... more675 is based on 11nm process...
16nm from TSMC is better than 14nm from Samsung (or comparaison, both were used on Apple A9)
12nm from TSMC and 11nm are 2 competitors (improvement of 16 and 14nm)
I don't think there is many difference between them.
Today, nm is more naming than transistor's density (except Intel...their 14nm is close to 10nm from competitors).
And using bigger cortex A76 in 11nm is probable more dangerous than using smaller A75 in 12nm...compare to 675 efficiency can be better on P90. But will not compare to 710/670. De must see serious oem for that
About GPU, Manhattan test seems to be very close on P90 and SD710 (30 vs 33fps)
- ?
- Anonymous
- 08B
- 14 Dec 2018
Jamesschwarz987, 14 Dec 2018I hope your point about not believing on performance peak w... moreHow single-core perfs is increased?
By increasing Instruction Per Cycle (IPC)
A73 runs 2 ISP
A75 runs 3
A76 runs 4
(Apple A12 runs 7)
Take these instructions
A+B=C
C+D=E
You need the C valor to calculate E...so that, you will need 2 cycles on every cores...the A73, like the A76.
To work, calculation must be parallelized.
You can parallelized by increasing ISP
Or by increasing number or cores.
In case or parallelized calculation, single-core isn't important, multi-core is...
In my opinion, increasing core is more efficient.
Because you can shut down a core, you can't shut down an ISP.
To run 2 ISP, a A73 will use the energy of 2 ISP...the A76 will use the energy of 4.
Results : single core on A12 on last iPhones is about 4500, and 2400 on SD845 (kryo 3 based on cortex A75)...Oneplus 6 isn't slower than iPhone
High ISP is focused on benchmark
- J
- Jamesschwarz987
- 6ca
- 14 Dec 2018
SoC Guy, 13 Dec 2018A downgrade it might be in performance, but it's not one yo... moreYeah since phones on this price range would uses cheapo eMMC memory, less core GPU, and any other cheap component that most tech-edgy people would never care/notice.
- J
- Jamesschwarz987
- 6ca
- 14 Dec 2018
Anonymous, 13 Dec 2018It's 4xA73 on P60... I think 4A73+4A53 is as good as 2A7... moreI hope your point about not believing on performance peak would feature some arguments, or i'll call this is a troll.
- J
- Jamesschwarz987
- 6ca
- 14 Dec 2018
Anonymous, 13 Dec 2018It's 4xA73 on P60...
I think 4A73+4A53 is as good as 2A7... moreYou probably are already impressed with that 1/3" 16MP, while i am not. I'm not even see Oppo or Vivo when it comes to camera, since their "selfie expert" and "AI" marketing are basically just big MP with extensive beautifier.
I really adore purity, unprocessed images on DSLRs, but when it came on smaller sensor like phones, i need some processing that could "surpass" what sensor at this size usually produce. And for me, Google Camera did it right.
- T
- TenMoon
- t@g
- 14 Dec 2018
Sounds interesting. With pure A75 cores at their disposal and quite strong GPU (Series9XM by PowerVR, too bad it doesn't utilizes the Series8XT GPU that theoritically way stronger), it will challenge the SDM670, if 710 is somehow too strong. Keep in mind that Helio P90 is fabricated under 12nm process. Efficiency of this chip will be not as stellar as the SDM670/675/710 with its 10nm process
- ?
- Anonymous
- 08B
- 13 Dec 2018
Jamesschwarz987, 13 Dec 2018I'm actually really wanted these Helio phones (P60 and late... moreIt's 4xA73 on P60...
I think 4A73+4A53 is as good as 2A75+6A55...
But expert said for years what is important is single-core's score...I disagree!
You can found good cameras with Helio P60...
I think my Oppo A3 with a single camera captures better picture than Mi A2 with SD660 and Dual-camera...
Pictures on Mi A2 are darker and dark parts are less detailled.
Triple ISP is capable to...OEM cameras implantation and software seem to be the problem
- S
- Shanti Dope
- Kg{
- 13 Dec 2018
Mi7even, 13 Dec 2018Adreno 506 is way less powerful than Mali G72 MP3 !!!! Mal... moreJust checked it out on Notebook Check site, and yeah you're right. The difference isn't really that big though, and for such an old GPU, the Adreno 506 is really holding up well in today's standards for mid range category.
- S
- Shanti Dope
- Kg{
- 13 Dec 2018
SoC Guy, 13 Dec 2018GPU isn't the only factor in recording, your DSP, camaera s... moreOh, okay thanks for that!
- S
- Shanti Dope
- Kg{
- 13 Dec 2018
Kiyasuriin, 13 Dec 2018well... FIRST OFF. I used raw calculation power to compare.... moreOkay, so you're saying that this GPU, as well as the Mali GPUs I've mentioned, are all more powerful than the Adreno 506, but with this PowerVR, it would drop to Adreno 506 GPU levels when it throttles??
Thanks for explaining!
- Z
- Zero
- Ksa
- 13 Dec 2018
So this Helio P90 is the Snapdragon 710 on CPU with the GPU of the 660?
interesting.
wondering if we will see the following Helio P22 and A22 succesors with this:
Helio P22 Succesor
--------------
- A75 X2 @1.8Ghz
- A55 X6 @1.8Ghz
- Mali G76 MP3 @700 Mhz
Helio A22 Succesor (being hexa with weaker Mali G76 GPU)
----------------
- A55 X6 @1.8Ghz
- Mali G76 MP3 @500 Mhz
- Mi7even
- Nkc
- 13 Dec 2018
Shanti Dope, 13 Dec 2018Wait, so you're saying that this phone roughly has as power... moreAdreno 506 is way less powerful than Mali G72 MP3 !!!!
Mali G72 MP3 is almost as powerful as Adreno 512 , check the reviews of mobile phone , benchmark section , at 3D tests , see the numbers there ..
- ?
- Anonymous
- xq5
- 13 Dec 2018
Anonymous, 13 Dec 2018Snapdragon KillerNever. Snapdragon is almost perfect.
- ?
- Anonymous
- 08B
- 13 Dec 2018
SoC Guy, 13 Dec 2018They took a "break" from flagship SoCs for 2018 to focus on... moreThe only true X, is X30...
X20 was somewhere in the middle...
High performances cores
High encoding/decoding engine
Dual camera support
Already heterogeneous multiprocessing AI
But only
20nm instead of 16nm
Emmc instead UFS
Mid GPU
If they release X20 today, they probably name it as P serie.
Nevertheless, it's a good soc...
- ?
- Anonymous
- 08B
- 13 Dec 2018
SoC Guy, 13 Dec 2018where did you get those numbers? because these say otherwis... moreMy mistakes, sorry...
I see these FPS on an other website and didn't verify.
Mistakes Come from Manhattan version.
On P60 (on my on Oppo A3), Manhattan 18fps, Manhattan 3.1 11fps...
I should verify before posting
;-)
- S
- SoC Guy
- fwW
- 13 Dec 2018
AnonD-804996, 13 Dec 2018Is Mediatek done with Helio X series? They offered incredib... moreThey took a "break" from flagship SoCs for 2018 to focus on their profitable low and mid range market, and that was a very smart move.
The X20 was a flagship that lagged behind other SoCs so much it was used in Midrange phones, the X30 was also behind other flagships in performance while not being that cheap due to using 10nm process iirc. Disregarding if it was good or not as it is, the helio X30 was a huge commercial failure with only one phone adapting the SoC, mediatek's brand took a huge hit and it had to rebuild it, they decided to focus on their strong points and released the P60, which has been by far their best product overall, it was so good Qualcomm had to launch the 710 while the SD660 barely had any phones using it to secure its leadership in the midrange market, as P60 phones were scoring comparably to the 660 while being cheaper.
I expect they're building their experience with newer tech at higher scales gradually, with the P60 and P90, they might release an actual competitive flagship against qualcomm if they can manage to find a worthy GPU