Roku removes YouTube TV from its app catalog amidst contract disagreements

1 May 2021
Roku claimed earlier this week that Google’s requirements were anticompetitive and now Google is pointing fingers back.

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  • 22 Jun 2022

Anonymous, 04 May 2021It's known that Google manipulates search results ever... moreI said no politics or religious discussions. Please stick to tech topics here, GSMArena will not tolerate posts advocating any political or religious views or causes

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    • Anonymous
    • xDs
    • 04 May 2021

    It's known that Google manipulates search results everywhere. They want the left liberal side that is against truth to be at the top of the lists. The paid results first of course (not just the ads). And, the news that makes people fear.
    Pretty sure Bing is doing that now, it didn't before but I noticed their search results are more like Google's type now, just not as good in intent.

    Gog El, I mean Google, is evil, plain and simple. The truth will be out one day. They're an evil organization owned by evil people, not their puppet CEOs.

      • r
      • really
      • PAc
      • 03 May 2021

      DanielSmith, 02 May 2021You cannot let your customers without Google's YouTube... moretry reading the article again

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        • Anonymous
        • sUS
        • 02 May 2021

        Jeez, just buy an old thinkpad and connect to dumb tvs. Android tvs and to certain extent, sticks, are really bad ideas.

          Hemedans, 02 May 2021you didnt answer my question, and give lot of nonsense excu... moreI think you didn't even read my message, or you're too dumb to understand. I just came up with an example of an Android TVs which cost more or less the same as the TV with old SOC. So it's clear that cost is not the issue here. Regarding no streaming sticks available, I don't make them so I can't tell why aren't they available, but it's clear the cost is not the issue. Possible reasons being, these chips are new and the manufacturers are taking their time to work on them, lack of awareness, chip shortage, or maybe some other motive. But it's clear that cost is not the factor.

          And you can still buy the old-gen streaming sticks, they'll be often on sale and cost the sweet $25. But for the new devices, consumers should get the option of latest hardware, even if it costs slightly more. Those whose budget is limited have the option of buying older devices. And nothing changes in new devices anyway. Amazon will launch a new firestick with more button on its remote, and keep the same SOC as 2018 and call it Firestick 2021.

            salarx, 02 May 2021I don't have any example of TV sticks or box, but Moto... moreyou didnt answer my question, and give lot of nonsense excuse. the truth you dont want to hear, you cant make $25 tv streaming stick and include support for av1.

              Hemedans, 02 May 2021you think 4k soc is low end even Amazon who sell tv stick f... moreI don't have any example of TV sticks or box, but Motorola Revou / ZX Pro series of TVs come with MT9602 SOC, which has AV1 support. The 43" 4K TV ZX Pro sells for ₹28999 ($391) and 43" 4K Revou sells for ₹29999 ($404). The old generation ZX sold for ₹29999 ($404), which was launched in 2019 (and didn't have AV1 support). But sale price doesn't show the whole picture, right? The MSRP of ZX was ₹46050 and that of ZX Pro is ₹46999, a difference of $13 dollars. The MSRP of Revou is ₹35999 ($485).

              Just to put things in perspective, the TV with new SOC isn't expensive. Infact, it is on sale for $13 less. It is compulsory for new Android TVs to adopt the new AV1 codec. Motorola was just an early bird who launched the TV's with new SOC back in November. Bear in mind, same doesn't apply to Firestick or any other streaming device which doesn't run on Android TV platform, that's why you won't find it in Firestick soon, but it might eventually come since Amazon is not brain dead like Roku.

              You can read more about the new SOC here-

              https://www.mediatek.com/blog/motorola-revou-series-smart-tv-powered-by-mediatek

                salarx, 02 May 2021Atmost only two types of SOCs are there, one that supports ... moreyou think 4k soc is low end even Amazon who sell tv stick for dirty cheap sell them for $50 and with discount for more than $30. maybe show us that lowend hardware with those soc you mention?

                  Hemedans, 02 May 2021not old chip for cheaper, low end chip for cheaper. And if you want to go even lower, Amlogic has hardware with 1080 60fps AV1 decoding already. More support is likely to come in future. So low end hardware is not an issue. The real issue is low end old hardware.

                    Hemedans, 02 May 2021not old chip for cheaper, low end chip for cheaper. Atmost only two types of SOCs are there, one that supports 1080p, and the other 4k. Moving forward we might have support for 8k too. The only differentiating factor is codec support. The newer chips might support newer codecs, and / or their new profiles and levels. And if some company is marketing a stick that supports 4KTVs, it should support all the major codecs. Also, all the new mainstream Mediatek 4KTV SOCs (MT9000 series) support AV1.

                      salarx, 02 May 2021So you're saying you can get old chips for cheaper as ... morenot old chip for cheaper, low end chip for cheaper.

                        Hemedans, 02 May 2021roku dont manufacture soc, they buy from mediatek, rockchip... moreSo you're saying you can get old chips for cheaper as compared to new chips? Maybe it's acceptable in TV world to use 5-10 old year processors. But that needs to change, just like the smartphone world. And it's not only for Roku, everyone will have to follow it. That will increase the demand for chips, and eventually bring the cost down. Moreover after a complete transition, chips would be cheaper than before since they won't have to deal with royalties.

                          Hemedans, 02 May 2021all apple ecosystem support x265 and heic, even newer camer... moreOK I guess I missed the Apple side of things, Safari indeed supports hevc from version 14, since September 2019. Still it has patent issues, and most of the open source browsers don't support it. Pretty sure they are paying royalties for it, and they can afford is. But most non-profit cannot do the same, hence AV1 is the step in right direction. Even it took several years for Apple to adopt it, and AV1 support is already available in Firefox and most Chromium based browsers.

                            salarx, 02 May 2021It will be able to play it. Like most devices. The legacy f... moreroku dont manufacture soc, they buy from mediatek, rockchip etc, at current market if they buy soc with all blow and whistle to support AV1 do you think they can keep $25 price? dont you think its hard for them and Google is selfish here?

                              Hemedans, 02 May 2021so you want to tell me old phone wont be able to play youtu... moreIt will be able to play it. Like most devices. The legacy format will be supported. It's part of technological transition. Windows was able to run 16-bit apps for a long time. Apple will offer support for x86 for a long time before it completely migrates to arm. But for that switch to start happening, 3rd party manufacturers should agree to support the new technology, else the transition would never happen. And best time to do it when the agreement expires. Say, if Google still agrees with Roku now, Roku gets the pass to not migrate for the agreement period, and that eventually affects the codec rollout. And I agree it benefits Google because of it's efficiency, but it benefits the Users, and app developers too. If you're a developer working on streaming service, you won't have to encode different videos for browser, Android, and TV, since same file will be stremable on all platforms. Roku's stand is anti-developer and anti-user. And the agreement is only for new devices manufactured, old device will keep working as they are.

                                salarx, 02 May 2021Which browser supports x265 exactly? None of the browser su... moreall apple ecosystem support x265 and heic, even newer camera from iphone capture HEIC, safari support it too.

                                also all browser nowadays use gpu, i can stream h265 fine via my gpu.

                                  salarx, 02 May 2021And what's wrong with cheaper hardware? Well you see G... moreso you want to tell me old phone wont be able to play youtube? i have symbian s60v3 phone from 10 to 15 years ago, it use rts protocal and you know what? it can play youtube. roku is much much better compare to that phone. just accept it man, Google will ban anyone who dont allow them to collect user data, even microsoft was banned for same reason, that html5 was just an excuse.

                                    Hemedans, 01 May 2021X264 and x265 are everywhere in web they both have royaltie... moreAnd what's wrong with cheaper hardware? Well you see Google is pushing thing only on Android TV and not on Android Phones, simply because mobile processors are capable enough to decode AV1 without hardware support. TV's and other low end hardware have a dedicated chip to decode the video. The new Apple TV might be expensive, but it's powerful enough to decode any xyz codec with a software update, or 3rd party player like VLC. Nothing wrong with cheap hardware, but atleast it cheap be capable of playing videos from major apps like Youtube and Netflix. What Roku is saying, it's like a smartphone manufacturer saying they won't support latest version of android and snapdragon processor, since it increases the cost of device.

                                      Hemedans, 01 May 2021X264 and x265 are everywhere in web they both have royaltie... moreWhich browser supports x265 exactly? None of the browser support it (some of them might handover decoding to hardware), but web doesn't support x265. X264 is also an abomination, since most hardware are only limited to 8-bit x264, and that too 1080p. And isn't smaller size video better for user too? Not everyone in the world has access to unlimited internet.

                                        You cannot let your customers without Google's YouTube, its just like using a smartphone without Google play services, that's a closely comparison, I don't know but I think Roku customers are entitled to some lawsuits now against Roku because they're ripping out youtube because Roku officials aren't capable to strike a new/contract deal with Google, just like UK politicians were in a deep crisis in 2016 and fooled its own people into brexit without showing them the big picture and now in 2021 they are seeing the effects of their stupidity.

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