Samsung launches Expert RAW camera app for Galaxy S21 Ultra

24 November 2021
It comes with 16-bit DNG RAW support with embedded HDR processing on all cameras.

Sort by:

  • ?
  • Anonymous
  • gBV
  • 25 Nov 2021

It would be nice, if the S21 Ultra/S21 could capture 108/64 megapixel raw files (as far as I know this isn't possible?).
The S21 is the only phone with a high resolution Bayer sensor. There are only a few phones with a higher Bayer array resolution than 12 megapixels, so if one needs raw files with more than 12 megapixels, there seems to be nearly no alternative over a large camera. A few years ago, there was the Xiaomi Mi Note 10, which offered 27 megapixel raw files as far as I know.

    • C
    • CivilizedEntity
    • LaE
    • 25 Nov 2021

    Nick Tegrataker, 25 Nov 2021Thanks! I looked through the images and unfortunately, you ... moreI agree. I admit, the idea of stacking RAWs is interesting but the results not so much. It would be much better if they'd just let us use a toggle to choose between normal RAW and the stacked one and everyone could choose from that. Of course, I'm happy they even chose to enable RAW support for all cameras. To some extent, they paid attention to the users requests but I wish they would ignore the competition for a while and just give us the real deal.

      CivilizedEntity, 25 Nov 2021Sure thing. I uploaded a few on wetransfer here: https://we... moreThanks! I looked through the images and unfortunately, you were 100% right, all of them seem to have a very strong painted look regardless of the lighting condition. Highlights are easily recoverable which is nice, but some of the high ISO indoor shots have ridiculously noisy shadows that turn into a blotchy mess as I lift them up, looking almost as if the files have gone through some lossy compression. Google and Vivo also have their own stacked HDR RAW solutions, but neither of them are even close to being this mediocre.

      To conclude: currently, Samsung's HDR RAW is very similar to Apple's ProRaw (which I'm already not a fan of), but worse - noisier in shadows and details are even more smoothened out during the day. I'm hoping that Samsung will iron out these issues before this feature gets out of beta, because right now it's pretty embarrassing for them.

        • j
        • johnnybegood
        • p5$
        • 25 Nov 2021

        Dometalican, 24 Nov 2021Well let's see: 1. Less bloatware 2. Better option... morewell agree on some points but others what you call bloatware i call them features...also dont forget Samsung has longer sofware support than Sony Xperia's 3 years vs 2 years and lower prices or better deals.
        Screen aspect ratio for movies is a endless debate..
        Battery management i think is still a bit better on Sony.

        Camera hardware and software is also much better on Samsung with their own gallery app.

          • C
          • CivilizedEntity
          • LaE
          • 25 Nov 2021

          Nick Tegrataker, 25 Nov 2021Yep, I can definitely see some trace of noise reduction. Re... moreSure thing. I uploaded a few on wetransfer here: https://we.tl/t-28xVW3gFWA

          Currently we have sunlight here and I couldn't find any outdoor low light situations.

            • B
            • Borbotik
            • JAr
            • 25 Nov 2021

            CivilizedEntity, 25 Nov 2021Yes, I did test it myself. I've linked the test photos... moreYour link won't open

              CivilizedEntity, 25 Nov 2021Yes, I did test it myself. I've linked the test photos... moreYep, I can definitely see some trace of noise reduction. Regardless of the number of stacked frames, it shouldn't be "clean" like this when the single-frame RAW file is literally full of noise. It's quite disappointing that Samsung followed Apple's route for the approach towards stacked RAW instead of Google's.

              If you don't mind, is it possible for you to upload a few stacked DNG files for me? I'd like to edit them myself to see tonality, the amount of recoverable highlight/shadows or how good (or bad) they are in general. Thanks.

                CivilizedEntity, 25 Nov 2021Sorry for post error. Here is the correct link to the Exper... moreThanks, I'm taking a look at them right now.

                  [deleted post]I'm afraid you put the same link for both Stock and Expert camera apps so I'm seeing identical images..

                    • C
                    • CivilizedEntity
                    • LaE
                    • 25 Nov 2021

                    CivilizedEntity, 25 Nov 2021Yes, I did test it myself. I've linked the test photos... moreSorry for post error. Here is the correct link to the ExpertRaw photo... https://imageupload.io/i/OgByoFerKE

                      • C
                      • CivilizedEntity
                      • LaE
                      • 25 Nov 2021

                      Nick Tegrataker, 25 Nov 2021"It has heavy noise processing" From what I coul... moreYes, I did test it myself. I've linked the test photos down. Both images are taken woth 640 ISO and 1/10 exposure. One from the RAW of the main sensor in the stock camera app and one from the ExpertRaw app. Both DNG files were opened in Photoshop Express, all settings on default. No noise reduction applied, no brightness, nothing. As you can clearly see, the image from ExpertRaw has noise supression on. Again, this is not the point of RAW files.

                      Stock: https://imageupload.io/i/1DKUvM7ldP
                      Expert: https://imageupload.io/i/1DKUvM7ldP

                        • A
                        • Alpha
                        • 80i
                        • 25 Nov 2021

                        ToneTheBone925, 24 Nov 2021I can't wait for the Sony Xperia Pro I.....I love that phone, has almost everything I need and more. But my 1iii is chugging along just fine..its still new to replace ;D

                          CivilizedEntity, 25 Nov 2021Bottom line, it's not pure RAW. It has heavy noise pro... moreBut won't that result in worse looking images in RAW, at least initially?
                          We all know how JPG stacks multiple images just to get a light HDR effect mostly all the time.

                          And how do you do RAW with stacking? Is there a way?

                            CivilizedEntity, 25 Nov 2021Bottom line, it's not pure RAW. It has heavy noise pro... more"It has heavy noise processing"
                            From what I could gather, no, it doesn't any processing baked into the file.

                            "that is not what enthusiasts are looking for"
                            But it drastically improves the signal-to-noise ratio and post-editing flexibility, making it much more suitable for scenes involving static objects or landscapes. The app also allows you to shoot single-frame RAWs, if that's your preference.

                            "The final DNG is worse than the stock camera JPEG"
                            I don't what you mean by "worse", but did you test out the app yourself?

                              • C
                              • CivilizedEntity
                              • LaE
                              • 25 Nov 2021

                              Bottom line, it's not pure RAW. It has heavy noise processing. The app is stacking multiple raws to get the final result but that is not what enthusiasts are looking for. The final DNG is worse than the stock camera JPEG. We need pure RAW for the 108 sensor, no gimmicks and raw for all other lenses, no stacking, no processing, no nothing. Come on, Samsung...

                                • D
                                • AnonD-762416
                                • Sec
                                • 25 Nov 2021

                                Nick Tegrataker, 25 Nov 2021Got it, that's definitely great to hear. Thanks for le... moreThat does seem likely considering the timing.

                                  AnonD-762416, 25 Nov 2021I have already written here that the Korean information sta... moreGot it, that's definitely great to hear. Thanks for letting me know.
                                  Hopefully S22 series will have this feature baked into the camera app right out of the box.

                                    • D
                                    • AnonD-762416
                                    • Sec
                                    • 25 Nov 2021

                                    Nick Tegrataker, 25 Nov 2021I agree. It's a beta feature, so it's quite natur... moreI have already written here that the Korean information states that this beta is separate because it is a beta. It will be integrated into the camera app once they're done ironing out all the kinks.

                                      • D
                                      • AnonD-762416
                                      • Sec
                                      • 25 Nov 2021

                                      SuuperBaka, 25 Nov 2021"Technically it is done by the hardware, but does it m... moreAgain, a 108MP sensor is set up to work like a 12MP sensor. They just give you the option to run it 108MP for the reason I've said. This is designed to works as binned sensor. Just like your red, green and blue sub pixels are binned into one pixel on the image. The colour sub pixels adds up to one visible colour, the binned pixels adds up to one less flawed bigger pixels. You know, the same way you do super sampling on your PC. Clear out the noise by weeding out the flaws with maths.
                                      So, the RAW image info is 12MP.

                                        • ?
                                        • Anonymous
                                        • vjX
                                        • 25 Nov 2021

                                        Anonymous, 24 Nov 2021Xperia 1ii with two photo apps = " Why this? So unnec... moreYou either have lots of stocks in Sony or are just a silly fanboy.

                                          2 of 6